Salary Cap Violations

[kevin]

Diamondbacks was over the cap by roughly $11M after bidding this week and is still over by roughly $4M due to his deal with the Red Sox.

As stated in the rules, "Remember that you can NEVER exceed the salary cap or ALL of your bids will be revoked."

Padres has put herself over the cap after bidding this week with still no resolution.

As always, going over the cap is NEVER allowed, for ANY amount of time. No excuses.

The penalties will be pretty lenient as Jason, Preston, and I generally felt these were possibly just honest mistakes.

All of the SP's won by the Padres and Dbacks last week will go back into bidding this week. The Padres and Dbacks WILL be able to bid upon these players, along with everyone else. Obviously nobody will be awarded a player if he puts that team over their cap.

Here is this list:

Doug Davis
Noah Lowry
Brett Myers
Bronson Arroyo
Erik Bedard
Justin Duchscherer

[Royals GM (Mac - Retired)]

"Please note that this dynasty league was designed to create problems and friction so that managing your team is imperative."

this is the opening line to the 'salary cap' section of the rules

we have two teams (Padres and Dbacks) who have violated these rules by going over the salary cap with their bids

as the admin has said "The penalties will be pretty lenient as Jason, Preston, and I generally felt these were possibly just honest mistakes."

that is not what the rules says and they should not be interpreted in that way

from the rules "Keep in mind that your 50-Man Roster may not exceed 50 players, and you may not exceed your salary cap. If this is the case your transaction will be voided, and the free agent will be awarded to the next highest bidder. As a penalty, you will not be able to participate in the following week’s FA bidding."

there is also another rule that allows any team the opportunity to manage their bids with hopes of staying under the salary cap and that is 'the priority list'

from the rules, "In some situations there may be more players up for bid in which your roster/cap allows you to have, but you would like to take a stab at all of them in hopes of landing one or two. If this is the case you may send a priority list to the Free Agency account."

if the padres, dbacks or any other team didnt offer a priority list to keep themselves from going over the cap, there should be no leniency.

when i made my bid on matt holliday, i had several other players that i bidded on and i also sent the scott boras account a priority list and also PM'd preston to make sure that i stayed under the salary cap. these teams, as well as everyone else should have to do the same.

i dont get how you can be lenient on san diego and dbacks(a fellow admin) but you are being as harsh as you were on the yanks for the yanks/angels trade

your response was:

"It was clearly stated in Amendment #1 of the rules that you cannot trade a signed free agent for two weeks. This is unacceptable and blatant abuse of the rules. As a result, this trade will not only be vetoed, but there will also be penalties.

Because of not just this incident, but some other concerns from the Commissioner's Office, Harris will NOT be able to make any transactions for the same amount of time until Damon's ineligible to be traded. This also includes free agency.

This may seem like a harsh penalty, but this is to set an example that you must follow the rules and not abuse them at ALL TIMES. In the League Constitution, I stated that I would be allowed to impose penalties if rules were broken and I'm exercising that right. May this be a wake-up call for everybody."

going over the salary cap, without taking measures to keep yourself from going over the cap, is just as harsh as bending a 2 week trading hiatus on awarded FA's

the admin needs to be as strict on SD and AZ or any other team that breaks the rules, whether through mistake or not, as they were with the Yankees

this is the only fair thing to do, IMO

[wrigley]

The Padres and Dbacks WILL be able to bid upon these players, along with everyone else.

I do not agree what so ever with the above ruling.

I believe that Royals has a very valid point and no where in the rules does "honest mistakes" appear. All rule violations should be dealt with equally. I believe we all had to read and confirm reading and also agree to these rules. If suspensions are passed out then they should be passed out to all not to some. I wouldnt expect anything less if I was in that situation.

I am done clamoring.

[raisingarizo]

Honest mistake but since I expect the rules to apply to all teams I am notifying you that I violated the rules concerning FA bidding last week. The player I won (Steve Johnson) was added to my roster on Sunday (Sat I was awarded 3 players for the 1 spot I asked for and I had to check with PB). This addition was made before Mario Martinez was released. I know this is really minor and maybe not worth the time of a response. However that is not my decision to be make. Let me know if you decide to penalize me. There is no "next highest bidder" to award the player to because I bid $.3M the minimum / (under FA bidding rules). Sorry for the error. Mariners GM

[Deleted]

For the record and with out geting to complicated, I did have a priority list in play, and I made sure that my list was compliant with what I had believed my salary cap was. However upon further review when I adjusted one of my players Arbatration deals on my team page I didnt fully account for that. There fore leading to me going over cap.

How ever If I had known that, I would have obviously modified my priority list or made my other trade that I had set up, at the same time I made my deal with the Red Sox. But based on my calculations It wasnt necisary. For example I had won Bonser and Nieves for pratically league minimum and I didnt keep them because based on my calculations I only had 220K of cap room. If given the oportunity I could be under the cap in a matter of seconds.

Considering the precautions I took, when I redid my original priority list to conform with my believed salary cap. I dont think that I am oversteping my boundries in asking for this.

[mikekottka]

Please read the bold lettered section please.
This is copied directly from the rules on Free agent winning bids;


Free Agent Bidding Schedule


Monday 12:00 AM Eastern-Wednesday 11:59 PM Eastern - To put a player up for bidding, simply post his name in the Contract Offers Section. This may be done at the times mentioned above, and no later. You do not need to state your intent to bid on this player. This gives each GM some degree of secrecy as to your bidding each week. If you want to place a bid for a player that has been named up for bid, please PM the Free Agency account with your offer.

Friday 11:59 PM Eastern – This is the deadline for bidding each week. The submitted bid via PM is date and time sensitive and it dictates if the bid is on time or late. Late bids will be invalidated. No exceptions.

Friday Midnight Eastern - The winning bids will be posted in the section entitled “Winning Free Agent Bids”. It is your responsibility to monitor the board and add any player you won to your roster. Keep in mind that your 50-Man Roster may not exceed 50 players, and you may not exceed your salary cap. If this is the case your transaction will be voided, and the free agent will be awarded to the next highest bidder. As a penalty, you will not be able to participate in the following week’s FA bidding.

The players in question should be given to the next highest bidders and the teams in question should not be allowed to bid on these players, if we are going according to the rules. Rules were made for a reason, i think we should honor them.
The Brewers

[Royals GM (Mac - Retired)]

"Diamondbacks was over the cap by roughly $11M after bidding this week and is still over by roughly $4M due to his deal with the Red Sox."
i dont get how this is an arbitration issue, no matter what you did in arbitration, you are still over the cap. you need to be responsible for every facet of your team's finances. the above rules still need to be applied to you and SD.

[wrigley]

Good to know you had a priority list in play. Mathematics is a key part to keeping a franchise in the proper boundries. I would like to make a friendly suggestion. If you go back and re-calculate your Batters figures you will find the problem to this entire situation we are chatting about.

C: Miguel Montero 2,000,000 (2PP) DBacks
CI: Lance Berkman 14,500,000 (10) DBacks
MI: Stephen Drew 3,400,000 (1PP) DBacks
MI: Ryan Roberts 400,000 (4PP) DBacks
CI: Mark Reynolds 420,000 (2PP) DBacks
OF: Justin Upton 410,000 (3PP) DBacks
OF: Chris Young 3,250,000 (13) DBacks
DH: Bobby Abreu 9,000,000 (11) Angels

Bench: Alfonso Sorriano 8,100,000 (12) Cubs
Bench: Conor Jackson 3,100,000 (2PP) DBacks
Bench: Jermaine Dye 6,100,000 (11)
Bench: Melvin Mora 1,100,000 (11) Rockies
Bench: Jim Thome 3,100,000 (10) Twins
Bench: Jed Lowrie 400,000 (4PP) Red Sox
Bench: Tony Abreu 300,000 (4PP) DBacks

This does not total $53,680,00 as listed on your page. It totals 55,580,000. I always encourage to my friends and myself to always double check your work. I also encourage people to check my work as well and if EVER I am in fault I too would like to be notified of my errors. Do not take this the wrong way.

[raisingarizo]

Kevin I think anyone you noticed violating the rules should be penalized by you (in PB's absence). I do think that the Brewers make a valid point that the voided player is supposed to go to the next highest bidder. Well actually it's in the rules. I will say this about the Diamondbacks. It is my understanding that he is1 of the commissioners. I could be wrong (it wouldn't be a first). If he is 1 of the commissioners and he has 5 stars under his name asking for leniency is in poor form. The rules say that the only person responsible for keeping a current accounting of their team is the team's owner. I'm sure he made a mistake. But the same claims are being made by all of the other teams being penalized (including myself). Are we going to start determining who is and isn't telling the truth. Of all teams that should be familiar with the rules he is at or near the top. Also asking for an exception is kind of a conflict of interest. I fully believe the Diamondbacks were not looking for an edge but everyone is expected to keep their team's info up to date. And everyone else is being penalized. The commissioner is the last team that should be an exception.

[Deleted]

Feb 2, 2010 12:32:50 GMT -8 @raisingarizo said:

Honest mistake but since I expect the rules to apply to all teams I am notifying you that I violated the rules concerning FA bidding last week. The player I won (Steve Johnson) was added to my roster on Sunday (Sat I was awarded 3 players for the 1 spot I asked for and I had to check with PB). This addition was made before Mario Martinez was released. I know this is really minor and maybe not worth the time of a response. However that is not my decision to be make. Let me know if you decide to penalize me. There is no "next highest bidder" to award the player to because I bid $.3M the minimum / (under FA bidding rules). Sorry for the error. Mariners GM

Mariners, I appreciate your honesty, and Brewers I was looking at this as well. With out starting a bid ordeal, I think we should allow all violaters 48hrs to get leagal and move on from there.

Because based on the rules, and based on the players released thread. About half the league violated not only this weeks FA but every week of FA so far. Because the rule states that you are never allowed to go over 50 men or over cap. There fore this means that everyone who signed a FA and then droped a player afterwards is in violation of the rule. Obviously there is a flaw in the rule, and From mine and Jasons standpoint this is something we need to adress.

How ever like I said before, instead of revoking half of the leagues bids for SP and OF. (It would be unreasonable and imposible to go back further then OF due to trades). I vote that we allow 48hrs for all gms to get legal and look at situations into solving this issue.

[Deleted]

Feb 2, 2010 12:47:22 GMT -8 Royals GM (Mac - Retired) said:

"Diamondbacks was over the cap by roughly $11M after bidding this week and is still over by roughly $4M due to his deal with the Red Sox."
i dont get how this is an arbitration issue, no matter what you did in arbitration, you are still over the cap. you need to be responsible for every facet of your team's finances. the above rules still need to be applied to you and SD.

That is taken out of context. I was never 11m over. going into FA I had 10.1m to work with, before my trade with the redsox. After that I had about 18m to work with (all of this is before FA). I only added 13.2m in FA this week leaving me with 4-5m in free space. However, the night of FA, I was contacted by the indians gm informing me that a few more of my players arbatration deals were completed that day and that I hadnt accounted for it. So I sent in a new priority list that would account for the new arbatration deals. That is where the arbatration came into play.

[Deleted]

Feb 2, 2010 12:54:37 GMT -8 @wrigley said:

Good to know you had a priority list in play. Mathematics is a key part to keeping a franchise in the proper boundries. I would like to make a friendly suggestion. If you go back and re-calculate your Batters figures you will find the problem to this entire situation we are chatting about.

C: Miguel Montero 2,000,000 (2PP) DBacks
CI: Lance Berkman 14,500,000 (10) DBacks
MI: Stephen Drew 3,400,000 (1PP) DBacks
MI: Ryan Roberts 400,000 (4PP) DBacks
CI: Mark Reynolds 420,000 (2PP) DBacks
OF: Justin Upton 410,000 (3PP) DBacks
OF: Chris Young 3,250,000 (13) DBacks
DH: Bobby Abreu 9,000,000 (11) Angels

Bench: Alfonso Sorriano 8,100,000 (12) Cubs
Bench: Conor Jackson 3,100,000 (2PP) DBacks
Bench: Jermaine Dye 6,100,000 (11)
Bench: Melvin Mora 1,100,000 (11) Rockies
Bench: Jim Thome 3,100,000 (10) Twins
Bench: Jed Lowrie 400,000 (4PP) Red Sox
Bench: Tony Abreu 300,000 (4PP) DBacks

This does not total $53,680,00 as listed on your page. It totals 55,580,000. I always encourage to my friends and myself to always double check your work. I also encourage people to check my work as well and if EVER I am in fault I too would like to be notified of my errors. Do not take this the wrong way.

Thats exactly what I was talking about with arbatration. The issue was with both Qualls and Drew. They were the last to sign a arbatration deal. (didnt sign till week of FA). However In hind sight my mistake was when I changed the salaries of Qualls and Drew I must have forgot to change the Batters, and Pitcher total salaries, there fore leading to the error. If you look at the old deals and new deals of Qualls and Drew, you will find that the difference's match what my believed salary was.

If that makes any sense.

[Deleted]

Feb 2, 2010 12:57:21 GMT -8 @raisingarizo said:

Kevin I think anyone you noticed violating the rules should be penalized by you (in PB's absence). I do think that the Brewers make a valid point that the voided player is supposed to go to the next highest bidder. Well actually it's in the rules. I will say this about the Diamondbacks. It is my understanding that he is1 of the commissioners. I could be wrong (it wouldn't be a first). If he is 1 of the commissioners and he has 5 stars under his name asking for cis in poor form. The rules say that the only person responsible for keeping a current accounting of their team is the team's owner. I'm sure he made a mistake. But the same claims are being made by all of the other teams being penalized (including myself). Are we going to start determining who is and isn't telling the truth. Of all teams that should be familiar with the rules he is at or near the top. Also asking for an exception is kind of a conflict of interest. I fully believe the Diamondbacks were not looking for an edge but everyone is expected to keep their team's info up to date. And everyone else is being penalized. The commissioner is the last team that should be an exception.

Its not so much that Im asking for leniency for me but leniency for the whole league. Because as the Brewers pointed out, there is a mistake in the rules. It wouldnt be just you or me that is effected. But half the league. And it wouldnt be just the 1 player it would be all players that you or any other team that went over 50 men at anytime had signed that week. And on top of this week it would be the same situation for any team that went over 50 men when they bid on OFs, and it should be for every other category, but due to trades it wouldnt be realistic to go back further then OF and SP. What I was asking was for a 48hr period for the entire league, and for the sake of the league and further complications. And if I had to guess, between this week and last week every gm was a violater at some point.

[Royals GM (Mac - Retired)]

in response to:
I think we should allow all violaters 48hrs to get leagal and move on from there.

Because based on the rules, and based on the players released thread. About half the league violated not only this weeks FA but every week of FA so far. Because the rule states that you are never allowed to go over 50 men or over cap. There fore this means that everyone who signed a FA and then droped a player afterwards is in violation of the rule. Obviously there is a flaw in the rule, and From mine and Jasons standpoint this is something we need to adress.

How ever like I said before, instead of revoking half of the leagues bids for SP and OF. (It would be unreasonable and imposible to go back further then OF due to trades). I vote that we allow 48hrs for all gms to get legal and look at situations into solving this issue.


there is a standing rule currently in effect,


pbfantasybaseball.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=fawinningbids&action=display&thread=480

"Remember that you can NEVER exceed the salary cap or ALL of your bids will be revoked. If you exceed the 50-man roster, you have 48 hours to make changes, whether via trade or releasing players."

what you are asking is for a rule change, in which there is a thread. you should bring up what you are proposing on that thread.

what we are

[wrigley]

There already is a 48 hour window for teams to maintain a 50 man roster.

pbfantasybaseball.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=fawinningbids&action=display&thread=480

This was posted January 9th, 2010 after the first week of the FA period. It was from Scott Boras when he was addressing the bid submission process.

[Deleted]

See I was looking at the "Freeagency" thread in the offical league rules. Where it says:

Friday Midnight Eastern - The winning bids will be posted in the section entitled “Winning Free Agent Bids”. It is your responsibility to monitor the board and add any player you won to your roster. Keep in mind that your 50-Man Roster may not exceed 50 players, and you may not exceed your salary cap. If this is the case your transaction will be voided, and the free agent will be awarded to the next highest bidder.

Which just further proves the point that there is a conflict of rules, that needs to be adressed like the brewers stated.

[Royals GM (Mac - Retired)]

look at the FA awarded list and the trade review for dbacks redsox

you were awarded the bid for eric bedard at 3:08am which initially put you over the cap by the 11 million that admin kevin is talking about at 3:53 you posted a trade that wasnt even accepted until 11:00 am. this is a violation of the salary cap. clear case. you need to watch your salary cap like a hawk. you still have pat neshak up for arbitration so you need to reduce you salary cap even more

then
DBacks / Red Sox
« Thread Started on Jan 30, 2010, 3:53am »

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
DBacks send:
C: Chris Snyder
P: Chad Gaudin
P: Esmerling Vasquez

Redsox send:
MI: Jed Lowrie

[wrigley]

I think that the rules are pretty cut and dry about bidding, allowing for prioritizing your bids to keep from exceeding your salary, time alloted to adjust your roster once FA has been finalized and exceeding the salary cap and how it won't(most of the time) be permitted. This is my last comment or clamor about the whole ordeal.

[Deleted]

Feb 2, 2010 13:31:32 GMT -8 Royals GM (Mac - Retired) said:

look at the FA awarded list and the trade review for dbacks redsox

you were awarded the bid for eric bedard at 3:08am which initially put you over the cap by the 11 million that admin kevin is talking about at 3:53 you posted a trade that wasnt even accepted until 11:00 am. this is a violation of the salary cap. clear case. you need to watch your salary cap like a hawk. you still have pat neshak up for arbitration so you need to reduce you salary cap even more

then
DBacks / Red Sox
« Thread Started on Jan 30, 2010, 3:53am »

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
DBacks send:
C: Chris Snyder
P: Chad Gaudin
P: Esmerling Vasquez

Redsox send:
MI: Jed Lowrie

Check your time stamps:

Erik Bedard - DBACKS
« Thread Started on Jan 30, 2010, 5:08am »

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
DBacks offer SP Erik Bedard

2 year, $22.2M, AAS - $11.1M

2010 - $9.1M
2011 - $13.1M


And its already been established that a trade is consider valid when it is posted. Red Sox and I had been working on a trade all week so I could free up some cap. We agreed, I verified and then posted. He couldnt offically agree until morning because he wasnt near a computer.

[Royals GM (Mac - Retired)]

i am in the mountain time zone which states
Erik Bedard - DBACKS
« Thread Started on Jan 30, 2010, 3:08am »

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
DBacks offer SP Erik Bedard

2 year, $22.2M, AAS - $11.1M

2010 - $9.1M
2011 - $13.1M

it also states:

DBacks / Red Sox
« Thread Started on Jan 30, 2010, 3:53am »

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
DBacks send:
C: Chris Snyder
P: Chad Gaudin
P: Esmerling Vasquez

Redsox send:
MI: Jed Lowrie


-Red Sox to confirm


whether i am in the mountain time zone or the eastern time zone, you still made the trade 45 minutes after you were awarded bedard.

in the eastern time zone you were awarded bedard at 5:08 am and the trade was posted at 5:53 am